Not Real Runners

Not Real Runners

By John Biel, Sara Lupien

If you're the casual runner who would rather have fun than a good finish time, we're the podcast for you. We're the type of runners that run for pizza, are more concerned with our costume than pace, and stop to pet every dog. Join us as we make our way through the world of running in the back of the pack.


COVID Cancellations

In this episode Sara and John go into what they think these next few months may look like as races make the difficult decision of whether or not to cancel. 
29/04/201h 1m

Zion Half Marathon

Hello, we're bringing you a bonus episode in these times of little entertainment! John was able to attend his first Vacation Races event and wanted to give some good words!
30/03/2049m 33s

Ask Us Anything

We put out the call for all your questions and now we're here to answer them!
05/02/201h 8m

Club RunDisney & Marathon Recap

The 2020 RunDisney Marathon weekend was as wild as ever. And more importantly, we go over ClubRundisney, Rundisney's newest debut! 

Bad Pinterest Advice

This week we go over what was in my time capsule along from 2005! We also take some time exploring severely misguided advice on diet and exercise from Pinterest. 
15/01/2049m 5s

Brittany Runs A Marathon

Brittany runs a marathon is now on amazon prime and we wanted to chit chat about our thoughts. We had very different thoughts on the movie... Hear our thoughts here! 
01/01/201h 3m

Krampus Christmas Punishments

Merry Christmas! This year we are taking the role of Krampus and doling out punishments to all our least favorite people in the running community. 
25/12/1938m 51s

Universal Studios Hollywood 5K Review

We ran the Universal Studios Hollywood 5K and have a lot to say about it! 
18/12/1957m 38s

Running Through Election Year

It's that year again... we discuss how you can best get through this next election year using your running and races.   
11/12/1939m 49s

Christmas Quiz & Holiday Races

Do you think you know your Hallmark Christmas movies? Play along with a friend to our Christmas Movie Quiz!! Then we talk about Christmas races. 
04/12/191h 2m

What's Ragnar??

We have some very special guests come over and tell us all about Ragnar! What's Ragnar, why it's great for slow runners, and COSTUMES! 
27/11/1954m 28s

2020 Olympic Marathon and Cell Phone Obesity

We're back! We're here to tell you all about the Japanese Olympic Marathon and how your cell phone is leading towards obesity.
20/11/191h 44m

Disneyland Paris Half Marathon

Planning on doing the Disneyland Paris Half Marathon? John ran the 2019 event and has all the details of the event. Plus we fill you in on the drag party, a murder mystery, and some other fun stories!
10/10/191h 44m

Summer 10: Ten Things We're Excited About

As we wrap up our summer, we want to talk about what we're most looking forward to! 

Summer 9. Meal Prepping & Quiz

You know when you find a recipe online and there is a 3-page story before they get to the ingredients? We go over some of the worst blogs and our favorite recipes! 

Summer 8: Costume Brainstorming 2019!

It's always fun to be one of the first people to do a run costume of a new character. Now that there will be plenty of new characters introduced in this summer's movies we brainstorm potential new fun costume ideas!  
26/06/191h 7m

Summer 7: Sara's Trip Report

Sara is home from vacation and actually did some running in Greece. Listen for Greece deets, running the Olympic stadium in Athens, and obviously, shenanigans. 
19/06/1955m 11s

Summer 6: ASMR & Why A Tri?

We have a very special episode with a guest co-host. Friend of the show, Zach, goes over how different running in a triathlon is compared to running in a race. Also special entreprenwhore, Mario, gives us an ASMR treat. 
12/06/191h 2m

Summer 5: How To Get Started (Again)

Whether this is your first time beginning to train for a race or your hundredth it can be tough to get motivated. We go over some helpful tips on getting started with your training. 
05/06/1945m 57s

Summer 4: Balloon Ladies

Today we have a fun quiz, we go over some theater recaps, and we talk about why you shouldn't be scared of the balloon ladies. 
29/05/191h 6m

Summer Episode 3: London Marathon Fat Shaming & Crossfit

Sara has been the snatch queen at crossfit and shares some tips if you've been curious about trying it. London Marathon does NOT get the back of the pack stamp of approval. Hear why. 
22/05/1959m 59s

Summer Episode 2: Dopey 2019

Hey team, although a bit late, John learned two new major take aways from this year's Dopey weekend. Doing dopey in 2020? Take a listen to learn from John's experience!
15/05/191h 14m

Summer Season 1. Chubbies 1K, RnR AZ

Hey honeys. We're back for a limited summer run! We've got 10 episodes for ya to beat the heat. This episode we update you on our lives and do two quick race recaps. 
08/05/191h 2m

Final Episode: Goodbye!

Whelp, it's about that time. Time to say goodbye! We've had a great 2 years with you. 
26/12/181h 4m

Christmas Bonus Gift

We have a Christmas gift for you in the form of a bonus episode! Cigna sent over 3 great articles to help your running and we're going to talk about them!
24/12/1834m 29s


Heat it up, turn it over, and give it some seasoning because we have a roast for you!
19/12/1820m 23s

Ep 105. We Talk About Medals

Medals, Medals, Medals!
12/12/181h 6m

Ep 104. Travel Report

John went to Hong Kong and Thailand and is now here to tell you all about it! 
29/11/181h 6m

Ep 103. Holiday Movie Quiz

We have an extra special holiday movie quiz for you today! I hope you have had your Hallmark channel on all month for research. This game would be perfect to play with a partner in the car!
21/11/1848m 33s

Ep 102: A Quiz About Race Number Decline

Sara FINALLY has her episode 100 gift for John (or has she had it all along?) and then they play "Guess how many runners ____ race has lost this year compared to last?" Make sure to play along!
15/11/1846m 53s

Ep 101. Wine and Dine Review

We had a great half marathon this past weekend for the RunDisney Wine and Dine half marathon weekend. We've got the details on the 10K, Half, Expo, Festival, AND MORE! 
08/11/181h 14m


We talk about our favorite moments over the past 2 years. Then we have Sara's article for me about running in costume. Afterwords we have our top 10 scary movies we would love to see turned into a race! 
31/10/181h 17m

Ep 99. Wine and Dine Preview

Doing Wine and Dine 2018? We've got our thoughts on the whole weekend!
24/10/1855m 45s

Ep 98. Chicago Marathon Part Deux

Episode 98 is here and it's all about the Chicago Marathon, well specifically the actual race itself!
17/10/1857m 13s

Updated Ep 97. Chicago Marathon

Updated File
11/10/1852m 39s

Ep 96. Orange Theory Fitness

Together we break down what Orange Theory is, whether we like it, and whether we think it's beneficial for runners.
03/10/1859m 47s

Ep 95. Sara's International Race! RnR Montreal

Sara's getting those passport stamps, jet-setting around the world, and becoming the international icon we know she can be... she went to Canada! Hear her review of RnR Montreal! And if you listen closely, you might just pick up a little bit of French!
26/09/1850m 7s

Ep 94. PART 2 Of How We Met

Please please please don't listen to this episode before you listen to episode 93. 
20/09/181h 1m

Ep 93. The Horror Of How We Met

How did we become so close? Like the two remaining people left at the end of a slasher film, we've stuck by each other since our first full time jobs at a ooky spooky crazy cooky place of business. 
15/09/1855m 43s

Ep 92. Running News

Running season is back and along with that we have two running stories. 
05/09/1832m 50s

Ep 91. Night Terror Quiz

It can be tough to travel with someone that isn't your spouse. To showcase this Sara has a quiz about night terrors. 
29/08/1835m 34s

Ep 90. Real Tips For RnR Las Vegas

RnR Vegas can be a tricky race weekend to make successful. We've got some tips on what to expect and have the best experience you can have. 
24/08/1846m 14s

Ep 89. RnR Vegas- Hotel Choices

There are so many options of where to stay when you go to RnR Vegas. We dissect what staying at each hotel says about you! 
15/08/1859m 59s

Ep 88. Sara's Back To School Tips

We had so much fun last week critiquing Sara's over the top blog article about summer run tips so we wanted to keep the party going. John made a blog in "Sara Style" about back to school running!
08/08/1846m 3s

Ep 87. Sara's Summer Tips

Sara wrote an article about how to spice up your summer runs and we're here to dissect it! Enjoy!
01/08/1844m 0s

Ep 86. Not a 3peat of RnR Chicago!

Hey we went to RnR Chicago this past weekend!! We are here to review that race weekend for you and tell you all the tea!
25/07/1859m 37s

Ep 85. We Need New Breadsticks

So with Papa Johns saying the N word at work, we are ditching the old breadsticks and we try some new ones to find a new staple. Will we find something new to replace the pillowy snacks we came to love? 
18/07/1852m 47s

Ep 84. 10 Things We Love About Chicago

We're getting excited for Rock 'n' Roll Chicago so we wanted to talk about the 10 things we love about Chicago! 
11/07/1844m 9s

Ep 83. Goals and Predictions Check In

We made some goals for 2018 along with some predictions. You don't just make resolutions and forget about them, you do a check in! 
05/07/1844m 27s

Ep 82. Going Forward....

We have a big announcement we need to say about the show!
27/06/1843m 35s

Ep 81. Costume Brainstorming (RunDisney & Rock'n'Roll)

Looking for ideas for a race costume? Well we've got a full brainstorming session to help you get a starting off point on your next race look!
21/06/181h 1m

Ep 80. MUSIC! Spnsrd by Mighty

Sara and John made running playlists for each other and evaluated them. You can listen along! 
13/06/1847m 7s

Ep 79. RnR San Diego Review

We're back once again for our favorite race on the Rock 'n' Roll tour!
06/06/1854m 23s

Ep 78. Runner Bingo (Pt. 2)

Going to a Rock 'n' Roll Race? We've got a whole list of what you'll see at a RnR race with no judgement.
29/05/1858m 55s

Ep 77. Bungee Workout

This week we tried out a new format of working out called Bungee Fitness. You might be surprised with what we think about it...
22/05/1832m 55s

Ep 76. All I Need Is 20 Minutes? Ya, No.

So we tried a work out that claims that all you need to do is 20 minutes a week... and we had some strong reactions to it. WHAT?!
15/05/1855m 55s

Ep 75. Big Sur Marathon Recap and Tips

Praise be! We survived the Big Sur Marathon! One of us technically isn't a finisher. Hear our experience of the Big Sur Marathon. Ever thinking of doing it yourself? This episode will definitely benefit you if you're prepping for your own trek up Hurricane Hill. 
01/05/181h 10m

Ep 74. RunDisney Dark Side Half Review

Guess what! We got lotsa weird things to point out about this race! Hear all about what we thought of the Dark Side Half! 
24/04/181h 18m

Ep 73. What We're Doing This Summer

We've got a plan for a large portion of our shows this summer. Hear about it now!
17/04/1820m 55s

Ep 72. What We're Proud Of (Corrected Version)

Hey everyone, this recent pride weekend we really started to think about what we're proud of. Listen to us talk about what we are proud of and how it applies to you. 
13/04/1859m 38s

Monday Night Disaster

Hey, we can't get focused to record a real episode tonight.... 
10/04/185m 13s

Ep 71. RunDisney Star Wars Half Preview 2018

We go through the event guide, what to look for, what to look out for, and our thoughts on this upcoming race weekend. 

Ep 70. A Running/Marathon Quiz

It's exactly what it sounds like.... A quiz! Sit back, get your thinking caps on, and see if you can follow along! 
27/03/1850m 45s

Ep 69. Running News

Hear some fun highlights of the world of running! Plus an extra special guest!!
20/03/1835m 23s

Ep 68. Little Rock Marathon Review (Part 2)

Last week we reviewed the expo and 5K of Little Rock Marathon, hear about the full. Most importantly, Sara embarrassed John in a brand new way, you'll want to hear this...
13/03/1856m 14s

Ep 67. Little Rock 5K Recap

Enjoy the sweet sounds of the first part of a 2 part episode about the fabulous Little Rock Marathon.
06/03/1833m 14s

Ep 66. Getting Swept/ Phoenix Mesa Marathon

We actually found a solid race we have almost no complaints about! Also, one of us didn't make it to the end. Hear about what it is was like for our first DNF.
27/02/181h 9m

Ep 65. Princess Half/ RunDisney Bingo

You provide the blank bingo forms, we'll provide you the things to look for at your upcoming RunDisney race! 
20/02/1844m 12s

Ep 64. What's The Deal With Big Sur?

Sara went to the renaissance festival and John went to Vegas this past weekend. Who hated their experience more? Also, have you heard people talk about Big Sur but not quite sure what the deal is? We've got you covered. 
13/02/1846m 23s

Ep 63. A Guide For Couples & Spectating

We see people try and support their boyfriend/girlfriend at a race all the time and see how poorly it can go. We have our tips for the best way to support your boo thang in their race!
06/02/1847m 40s

Ep 62. Our Roughest Race Yet

We did a local marathon in Gulf Shores, Alabama and it sure was a change of pace from the normal scene.
30/01/1849m 49s

Ep 61. RnR AZ Recap

This year at RnR Arizona we experience the first race of the "new" Rock 'n' Roll brand. Does it live up to the hype? Sara experiences the full this time instead of the half. Which race do you think she prefers?
23/01/181h 17m

Ep. 60 RunDisney Marathon Weekend Recap (& Dopey Challenge)

It's a little longer today and kinda John heavy but he has some stories to tell about the Disney Marathon Weekend! 5K + 10K + Half + Full, OH MY! 
16/01/181h 28m

Ep 59. Sara's Mini Episode

Hey everybody! We, like everyone, are catching up from Dopey. Here's a little mini treat to hold you over til next week, courtesy of your reigning pretzel queen.
09/01/186m 8s

Ep 58. Random Running News

A weird robbery with a twist and Runners World's predictions for 2018. Also hear about what it's like anytime John and Sara check into a hotel. You'll never guess what happens when Sara gets a call from a family member. 
02/01/1846m 49s

Ep 57. 2017 Recap and 2018 Predictions

In episode 5 we made some predictions for 2017 in racing. Now it's time to see how we did. Then we make new predictions for the year to come. Plus, see how well we kept to our new year's resolutions last year!
26/12/1749m 55s

UPDATED Ep 56. RunDisney Marathon Weekend Preview

Are you going to be at Marathon weekend? Are you doing your first Dopey challenge? We're running through what you need to know for that weekend including some important updates. 
19/12/171h 16m

Ep 55. What I Learned Pacing

Get excited for the Christmas Movie Quiz! Then it's time for some news about the Dallas (ugh) Marathon and Rock 'n' Roll. Finally some things John learned from pacing a race. 
13/12/1752m 23s

Ep 54. RnR San Antonio Recap

Sara's costume may have been a swing and a miss, John may be tired of teenagers screaming in his face, and we neither can think of Garrison Keillor's name. Enjoy a full review of the Rock 'n' Roll San Antonio 5K, 10K, and marathon. 
05/12/1756m 25s

Ep 53. Karen Chu

Truly one of the best race costumers is on our show for a chit chat! If you don't know who she is, you need to look her up right now! You might be surprised how relatable she is!
28/11/171h 5m

Ep 52. The NRR Roast!

Whelp, somehow we cheated death for a whole year. Listen to us get ROASTED!
21/11/1738m 28s

Ep 51. RunDisney Superheroes Weekend Review

John, Sara, and Mario talk about the weirdness of the last West Coast RunDisney race!
14/11/1749m 24s

Ep 49. RnR Savannah Recap & Tour Pass

Sara and John went down south to try out the Rock 'n' Roll Savannah Marathon. You may be surprised what we think of the race. Plus updates on the tour pass and Vegas concert. 
07/11/171h 12m

Ep 48. RnR LA & Halloween Recap!

There was a huge costume contest and you will never believe who won! In this episode we review Disneyland Halloween, West Hollywood, and most importantly Rock 'n' Roll Los Angeles Half Marathon. Happy Halloween!
01/11/171h 27m

Ep 48. RnR Denver Half & Running Costumer

How are people going to know how to Avenge The Strip? How will we know the best time to go to RnR LA Expo? Will we ever know the perks of the rewards program of Michaels? Listen and see! 
24/10/171h 3m


Say goodbye! 
19/10/1733m 21s

Ep 47. Competitor Shuts Down, RnR Denver 5K

Get HIGHped because we're reporting straight from the mile high city. Today we talk about the end of competitor magazine, the Denver 5K, and Christmas Vacation's cousin Eddie. 
17/10/171h 7m

Ep 46. RnR Vegas, Chicago Marathon, Halloween Costumes

We talk about the rock and a hard place Rock 'n' Roll Vegas is in, we go over the hottest Halloween costumes of the year and how to run in them, and we give all you couples out there a new pool game, the Mana-tease!
10/10/171h 4m

Ep. 45: All About RunDisney Dopey Weekend!

Expert advice from John and Sara about how to maximize your exhaustion during Dopey Weekend! We talk about the weekend, dining, going into the parks, and all the other fun stuff, because who wants to talk about training? NOT US. 
03/10/171h 5m

Ep 44. The Mad Pooper (Ughhhhhhhh)

The story on everybody's lips... and ass. 
26/09/1729m 51s

Ep 43. How To Drag A Non Runner On A Marathon Trip

News about a big RunDisney race, a change in Rock 'n' Roll, a race with an insane amount of cheaters, John's husband cooks in the background, Sara explains math, and then a bunch of other fun!
19/09/171h 17m

Ep 42. Disneyland 10K and Half Recap. (Good Job RunDisney)

John and Sara recap the 2017 Disneyland 10K and Half Marathon. Special Guest: Mario!
12/09/171h 19m

Ep 41. A Bib Thief and Dland Expo & 5K

Girl, wait until we tell you who is back. Go listen to Tinkerbell Street Justice episode as a refresher. It was also a hot one at Disneyland Half Marathon weekend. 
05/09/171h 2m

Ep. 40 RunDisney Ice Bath & Vancouver Marathon

Milk and lemon may be your next favorite alcohol mixer. Another race is cancelled. Queen Cindy is back to tell us about her favorite recipe for the perfect ice bath. 
29/08/1757m 39s

Ep 39. Disneyland Half Marathon Preview

Next week is the start of the running season again and we could not be more ready. Hear about changes, predictions, and what we're excited about for Disneyland Half Marathon! 
22/08/171h 34m

Ep 38. Rock 'n' Roll Layoffs (Maybe?) and Runs In Tutus

Sara's now shaping the young minds of impressionable children. John's doing something or other this week. Most importantly we have the very special guests from Runs In Tutus on the show to teach us the magic of running a race in a tutu. 
15/08/171h 16m

Ep 37. A Lotto-bout Race Lotteries

John and Sara check up on race news from previous articles and go over the chances of getting into any given race lottery. 
08/08/1757m 29s

Ep 36. RunDisney Updates, Little Rock Marathon, and QUEEN CINDY!

RunDisney rumors, San Francisco marathons may not get to run on the bridges, and what's the costume category for Little Rock Marathon?? Also, Cindy Rodriguez Copley is on for an interview! 
01/08/171h 10m

Ep 35. We Ramble About RunDisney Costume Guidelines

Just like the title said!! Woooooo! 
25/07/1756m 30s

(Actually) Ep 34. RnR Chicago Half Marathon and 5K Recap

Rock 'n' Roll Chicago is actually one of the best on the tour! Hear about that but also Sara's casts, John's first grade gym teacher, and pizza hut!
20/07/171h 15m

A Quick Lil Note

We had some major technical difficulties and the show's coming out on Thursday but we wanted to personally let you know. SORRY!!!! Are you mad? 
18/07/173m 42s

Ep 34. How to Train For A Marathon. (RunDisney or Little Rock Anyone?)

Completing a marathon changed both of our lives. Seriously. This episode is one you'll want to listen to multiple times as we throw a ton of information at you. If you've ever thought about training for a full we've got a ton of tips to get you started. Also, hear about the most awkward, random, and weird amazon mess up. 
11/07/171h 1m

Ep 32. A Huge Running Record & 2016 Marathon Statistics (Including RunDisney stats)

The stats from United States running in 2016 are in and they are actually pretty interesting. Which was the biggest? Were there more runners than last year? But besides that nonsense, we think we saw an easter egg in Cars 3, we talk about the world marathon challenge, and Sara's butch realness costumes are coming out. Listen with a friend! 
04/07/171h 5m

Ep 31. Portland Marathon and Rock 'n' Roll Seattle Recap

John and Sara waited all year for cotton candy grapes and finally got their grubby hands on some. Plus hear why they are excited for Little Rock Marathon. Then hear some news about the Portland Marathon. Then ending with a recap of RnR Seattle. 
27/06/171h 15m

Ep 30. MARATHON INVESTIGATOR INTERVIEW (Keeping that running community honest)

The one, the only, the marathon investigator came on our show! Plus at the end of the show Sara makes a really good printer joke. 
20/06/171h 25m

Ep 29. It's Better In The Back

GUYS, Papa Johns literally never wants to give us our extra cheese! Also we talk about race stuff. So there was this cute lil doggie that ran an Ultra in the Gobi desert. Also, hear why we like it better in the back... of the pack. 
13/06/1754m 24s

Ep 28. RnR SOLD and San Diego

Sara chomping on a salt lick, John and a bunch of middle schoolers loving the cotton candy blizzard, and all sorts of other junk on today's special recap of RnR San Diego! Hear about the sale of one of the biggest race series and why you should or shouldn't do RnR San Diego. 
06/06/171h 18m

Ep 27. A Pass For Races And Costume Hacks

John previewed the new Guardians attraction before it opened to the public, Sara brought over a new protein bar, and most importantly it's time to continue in the costume suite. 

Ep 26. Micro News and How To Choose Your Costume

We gots all sorts of little news pieces today! Then hear our 5 step process to choosing a run costume. 
23/05/1747m 40s

Bonus Episode! Tinker Bell Street Justice

OMG DRAMA!!!!!! Tinker Bell weekend was basically that scene in Hulu's Handmaid's Tale where the maids rampage on that one man, or in this case, a bib thief. Hear about the big drama of the weekend in this bonus episode! For more fun, follow John and Sara on Instagram at @BuiltByBiel and @SlowlySlupien. 
19/05/1717m 35s

Ep 25. Dafuq, RunDisney??

Editors' Note: Hey everyone, we got through the whole thing and then realized that Sara's mic wasn't picking her up all the way, so we thank you for being understanding she's a bit quiet. However we have a TON to talk about in regards to one of RunDisney's biggest disappointments. 
16/05/171h 33m

Ep 24. Tinker-Bingo

John is done with school and ready to party like a pirate this weekend at Tinker Bell Half! Sara is going to drink her jealousy away at home. There are some Boston Marathon cheaters you are really going to want to hear about.... Lastly, keep your eyes peeled for the following sights and sounds of Tinker Bell Half Marathon with our bingo list. 
09/05/1740m 22s

Ep 23. Race Travel Tips

This episode we hear about grad school draguation, or lack of, week one of Sherri Biel's extended residency in Phoenix, and the some tips from your resident experts about how to travel as cheap and efficiently as possible to your races. 
02/05/1755m 50s

Ep 22.5 Star Wars Recap Part 2

BONUS EPISODE!!!!!!! Hear what the Star Wars Half Marathon was like from a guest back of the pack'r!
27/04/1735m 42s

Ep 22. Star Wars Dark Side Recap Pt 1

Let me tell you ALLLLL about Star Wars Dark Side. Featuring our special whorespondent, Mario! 
25/04/1741m 36s

Ep 21, The Boston Marathon Show

Remember how we heard about all that marathon cheating?? Well it's finally catching up with a few people. Also, it's the 50th anniversary of a very special runner! 
18/04/1736m 57s

Ep 20. Changes To Tink, Raleigh, And The Barkley Marathon

Oh my god, we made it 20 weeks? John's brother is moving to Phoenix! We talk about changes to Disneyland Half Marathons, Rock 'n' Roll Raleigh's numbers, and what the heck is the Barkley Marathon? 
11/04/171h 6m

Ep 19. Arrogant Race Bandits and Dog Contest Winners

Between Sara and John, who do you think always had a white gum ball every single time growing up? We talk about travel tips, the ballsiest marathon bandits, and the winners of the Pet A Dog In A Race Contest are announced!
04/04/171h 4m

Ep 18. RnR Reveals A New Race, San Fran Recap

John started his new job today, Sara almost died from hill exhaustion, and the Rock 'n' Roll San Francisco Half Marathon may not be what you'd expect! 
28/03/171h 7m

Ep 17. Misdirected Marathons and RnR Dallas Recap

The sharks from shark tank come out to hear a great new product, hear about what happens when two marathons are cut short accidentally, and a recap of the RnR Dallas half. 
21/03/171h 23m

Ep 16. The Shade Show

Take off those sunglasses because it'll be hard to see with all the shade. This week we throw shade on all the things in running we hate. 
14/03/171h 22m

Ep 15. The Beer Mile Pt 2

John went to a fashion show with Scottsdale's elite and Sara went to bed. Last week we told you all about the rules of the Beer Mile. Now hear us tell you how it went when we tried it ourselves. 
07/03/171h 19m
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