When Pop Music Trolls Grow Up

New albums from Doja Cat and Tyler, the Creator place their makers — children of the internet with a taste for friction — in a new light. Guest: The Ringer's Justin Charity. Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher. For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.